What the Chinese are up to at a hardware level is a response but I’m fearing the Chinese are basically taking an open system and (like NVidia who are ten times worse than AMD/ATI ever were) are effectively closing it in practice. Micro Magic adviser Andy Huang claimed the CPU could produce 13,000 CoreMarks (more on that later) at 5GHz and 1.1V while also putting out 11,000 CoreMarks at 4.25GHz—the latter all while consuming only 200mW. I see the administrator has now added a performance per dollar section. I’m not getting into whataboutary or having words put in my mouth and as I think we’ve covered everything this is probably a good place to end discussion. Because RISC-V doesn’t dictate the implementation, extra instructions for emulation aren’t guaranteed to matter. As you said extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Huang demonstrated the CPU -- running on an Odroid board -- to EE Times at 4.327GHz/0.8V and 5.19GHz/1.1V. Cookies kunnen worden gebruikt om op Hardware Info advertenties te tonen en artikelen aan te bevelen die aansluiten op je interesses. For some or all of this to work via a fastpath or slowpath (could be hardware or software) the overall concepts and systems and regulations which enable this need to be worked out and specified. In addition vendors are allowed to create their own modules to push functionality down to the processor level (for example this is what WD is doing). This is true. At this point I’d be happy if someone with influence produce a discussion document covering things like acces to instruction sets, interoperability with things like transcoding, the OS and VM layers, support for end users investments in software, the use of escrow and barriers such as copy protection and copyright. Daarom kijken we vandaag naar de performance-per-watt, oftewel de efficiëntie waarmee processors werken. (It's worth noting that we had no way to run CoreMark … I’m bothered about the general purpose baseline versus the use case specific implementation issues. Dankzij cookies van derde partijen kun je daarnaast informatie delen via sociale media, zoals Twitter en Facebook. Does anyone have any ideas what? There are completely open and inspectable implementations of RISC-V that I think satisfy what you want, but at it’s core RISC-V is intended to spur innovation, research, implementations, etc by providing a common, IP-Free ISA. Sorry but I don’t get what you are saying. There was a universal core you could depend on with everything else being an extention. They add one or more layers of printed SolarPV to conventional PV to boost performance. I’ve been trying for so long to encourage everyone to be patient and form their opinions based on data rather than marketing claims. This is the level I’m kind of discussing. Performance metrics: delay (execution time) per instruction; MIPS *CPI (cycles per instr): abstracts out the MHz *SPEC (int or fp); TPM: factors in b’mark, MHz energy and power metrics: joules (J) and watts (W) joint metric possibilities (perf and power) watts (W): for ultra LP processors; also, thermal issues Tomas Hochstenbach 15 juli 2018 05:59 86 reacties Inhoudsopgave But it is also the ante to even be part of a CPU buying decision. As for whether it is good for all things all the time we don’t really know so comparing them to currents major CPUs isn’t an exact comparison. I’m a bit sceptical of RISC-V as it seems more of an American thing and wonder if pushing RISC-V is less about technical and equity issues and more about who ultimately controls and influences the CPU platform. Micro Magic adviser Andy Huang claimed the CPU could produce 13,000 CoreMarks (more on that later) at 5GHz and 1.1V while also putting out 11,000 CoreMarks at 4.25GHz—the latter all while consuming only 200mW. So to summarize, there is binary compatibility so long as bitness and ISA subsets match, but that doesn’t doesn’t mean that you can just move from one CPU to another and assume that IO and the like all work the same. What would also be good is a performance per watt section too. Om pagina's op Hardware Info te kunnen bekijken, moet je de cookies accepteren door op 'Ja, ik accepteer cookies' te klikken. It will be interesting to see how AMD will react to Intel's next-generation processors. While Apple claims the octa-core M1 delivers “the world’s best CPU performance per Watt,” the M1 breaks down to less than 100 CoreMarks per Watt, claims Huang, an industry notable who designed the Finesim simulator. No idea and the marketing puff doesn’t say. As a FOSS user, what I want most is a very consistent and reliable boot strapping process where the owner is in control with no proprietary dependencies. For a broader context there are software versus fastpath issues where a given OpenGL function may have been fully or only partially implemented in typically faster graphics card hardware . We would do the same if we were in their shoes. Ars Technica summarises and looks at the various claims made by Micro Magic about their RISC-V core. Het gemiddelde stroomverbruik vertelt niet per se het volledige verhaal over hoe zuinig een cpu is. Extraordinary claims requite extraordinary evidence, and I feel like some vague photos just doesn’t to the trick of convincing me. Woodcrest will give the server market more than 3 times the performance per watt of Intel's Nocona which debuted in 2004 and Merom will mean a 3x performance per watt boost for the mobile market since Intel presented the first Pentium M Banias in 2003. https://nequalsonelifestyle.com/2020/12/06/mm-riscv-vs-rock64-arm/. Implementations are potentially going to vary within a single semiconductor company, and this is what we want. Part 1, [Updated with response from Apple] Macs are a privacy nightmare, Working from home at 25MHz: You could do worse than a Quadra 700. We first noticed Micro Magic’s claims earlier this week, when EE Times reported on the company’s new prototype CPU, which appears to be the fastest RISC-V CPU in the world. I’m content to leave thinsg there for now. For lowering the TDP I would set the CPU frequency lower, something at 2.5GHz or 2GHz. This is why I asked you to define what you meant, and ended up making a guess. They probably learned a lot from microsoft’s x86 emulation and decided to go with hardware assistance. I do agree with your comments on why the Chinese are using RISC-V and other CPUs and what they are used for. The industry then broke down into industrial use versus game use. Core processors focus on energy efficiency and a better performance per watt ratio, which the Pentium M already offered. I’m more concerned about the abstract meta stuff like interoperability versus lock-in than what happens at the FAB end of the problem. Then again, last time I said anything about an upcoming processor, I was off by a million miles, so what do I know? When I say modular I mean that if you don’t want floating point, you can leave out that module, etc. Once you get to the FAB you are so caught up in proprietary processes you simply can’t be as open as you want (If I am reading you correctly), and if there were more restrictions placed on it then you wouldn’t see as many private companies adopting RISC-V so quickly (for example Western Digital). The lesson of Apple’s M1 is that you don’t need new instructions (to the best of our knowlege there are no additional instructions in the M1 for that), but a different Mode to implement the intel consistency model so the code would execute more like an x64 processor. What are the best "performance per watt" (measured in MFLOPS/W) for current CPUs and GPU's? I’m sure someone will find a use. I would choose something as Haswell Refresh or Skylake. It is indeed good advice to study the data and the rules behind what generated the data. To borrow from (classic) OpenGL again you have core functionality which is good enough for everyday use. In that SolarPV sector it’s more about heat management and durability when exposed to UV. For the M1, apple chose to implement x86 memory model in hardware rather than in software to avoid certain implied inefficiencies of software overhead. So am I, but times change. Interesting once the cost target was reached in printed SolarPV it hasn’t supplanted traditional silicon as first thought, but it’s become supplemental. You would be better served by talking in a less technical way, and in one that emphasizes clarity. This might be very interesting for the embedded market already, but I must really wonder about these details. For example: But isn’t it OK for those to be a subset of the whole, so consumers can choose, and still know that code will run on those processors transparently as proprietary implementations? It’s surprisingly difficult to convince people to detach themselves from preconceived opinions and look at the data sometimes. Since performance per watt is computed as a ratio of system performance (by some measure) divided by power consumed , a power-optimized CPU Performance-per-watt (DAPC) profile is the default, and represents an excellent mix of performance balanced with power consumption reduction. The nitty gritty of transcoding and subsystems (and VMs) cooperating with each other to anyone can run anything they like without vendor lock-in and forced obsolescence is a technical thing. The instruction pipeline was reduced to 12 stages, yet the fastest Core processor achieved a slightly higher clock speed compared to the Pentium M, thanks to a new 65 nm manufacturing process. I think we’re talking at cross purposes or have different goals or priorities in mind. Seeed studios sells various versions of them (and a rather cheap FPGA board if you want to experiment yourself). Can they scale to more demanding uses? Reading through wiki I note RISC-V have incorporated themselves in Switzerland to avoid the issue of unilateral sanctions. . Implementations are left to implementors. Ook derden kunnen je internetgedrag volgen, zoals bijvoorbeeld het geval is bij embedded video's van YouTube. Here is the thing, you keep asking low level questions (or ones that can only be answered in a low level way because of what RISC-V actually is), and then get seemingly upset when we answer that way. CPU Performance Per Watt The data shows that both AMD and Intel demonstrate higher peak performance than the ARM CPU but at much higher power. Based on the 7nm Zen 2 core architecture and an enhanced form of Vega graphics on the same node, AMD is promising up to 2x more performance per watt, compared to the existing Zen+ based embedded parts. RISC-V doesn’t concern itself with operating system interoperability but to dictate that would be to limit implentors. You need to seperate the meta issues from business decisions from implementation. Putting words in your mouth, huh? Apple specifically needed backwards compatibility in order to run their customer’s proprietary mac software, but not everyone is as tied down to x86 software compatibility. Given time (and this is still very new) you probably will see chip manufacturers who are as open as they can possibly be, hell we may see completely open fabs at some point.
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